A Great Team
  • I have a great idea, why don't some of the good advantage players on this forum come together and form a great team. I say get Renzey, Grifter, Bojack, Nickels and Bullets, and maybe a couple of others together and form the Hit Or Stand Team. I promise you I'd be willing to invest in it. I'd like to hear some opinions about this. It might not really happen but I sure wish it could just to hear actual results of top players combining talents to whip the casinos. I'm curious if the actual players would be up for it, and would anyone else like to invest. I say its at least worth talking about.
  • TCash said:
    I have a great idea, why don't some of the good advantage players on this forum come together and form a great team. I say get Renzey, Grifter, Bojack, Nickels and Bullets, and maybe a couple of others together and form the Hit Or Stand Team. I promise you I'd be willing to invest in it. I'd like to hear some opinions about this. It might not really happen but I sure wish it could just to hear actual results of top players combining talents to whip the casinos. I'm curious if the actual players would be up for it, and would anyone else like to invest. I say its at least worth talking about.


    Why would anyone invest $$ in Renzey, Grifter, Bojack or Nickels and Bullets?
    Why would you let loose these guys running from casino to casino with your money?
    Just give me your rationale,
  • Because Alex, I believe that they would have a very good chance of making money. In the same way as other super successful teams like the MIT teams. Its quite obvious what I meant by my previous post, just like its quite obvious that it bothers you to think that some might not think you're a top player. To be quite honest even if you were half as good as you think you are, I could'nt see myself investing one penny into you're bad attitude or ego. The players I've mentioned time and time again have posted insightful strategies and thoughts about the game. They also seem to be real life experienced in the game of blackjack. Although you're certainly entitled to your opinion, I really have become bored by your over the top, ridiculous, ideas and stories. I like the way the other guys think and I like their attitude.
  • Hey I think its a cool idea. I don't think the players would go for it unless they knew each other, but it would be something interesting to track if they did. Good players make great teams, and great players I think would make money making teams. Go for it .
  • TCash said:
    Because Alex, I believe that they would have a very good chance of making money. In the same way as other super successful teams like the MIT teams. Its quite obvious what I meant by my previous post, just like its quite obvious that it bothers you to think that some might not think you're a top player. To be quite honest even if you were half as good as you think you are, I could'nt see myself investing one penny into you're bad attitude or ego. The players I've mentioned time and time again have posted insightful strategies and thoughts about the game. They also seem to be real life experienced in the game of blackjack. Although you're certainly entitled to your opinion, I really have become bored by your over the top, ridiculous, ideas and stories. I like the way the other guys think and I like their attitude.



    Winning blackjack players — the cunning ones, at least — conceal the fact that they’re winning players. A “losing” image like the one that propose using progression or other methods brings profits at the table, gives longevity and keeps the taxman away from it.

    But let’s say that we want to determine who really is the best blackjack player in the world. To do so, we’d have to assemble a group of players and have them play lots of hands — millions of them, in fact. Ideally, we could set it up like a bridge tournament on national television and prearrange hands so that every player is faced with the exact same decisions. I can picture it now: Grifter on television playing 92 vs. A in a TC=1 while Alex playing 56 vs. T in a negative –6 count but using progression and being at the highest level with table max and winning. .., etc .. Quickly the camera focus back on Grifter that lost his double down but he bets max now because the count say so …etc. Now the world knows that Grifter is a better player than Alex? Or the other way around?

    Is Renzey a better players than Grifter? Or, Bojack is just playing his “A” game at all times? Or, Nickels and Bullets have more chips than Alex at the end of the day? (after all, it would be hard to control every variable)?

    In short, I think it’s nearly impossible to determine who the best player in the world is, unless you created a very controlled setting that lasted for several decades — which is impossible. But then again, how can you really be objective and track “results” — You can’t.

    All of this brings me to my choice for the world’s greatest blackjack player. Given that it’s such a subjective topic, my criteria are net profit and longevity. And thus, my choice lives far from the computer screen and far from writing nice and pleasant posts. My definition of the best players in the world would be the one who is masterful at cunning and at balancing risk and reward, he loves what he does, and he has made outstanding decisions for more than four decades, leading to enormous profits. And while he might be an underdog to the math theory, but he has made his living $$ solely from actually playing blackjack all his life and not by selling books, running web sites or distributing blackjack software or advice like: Wong, Snyder, Norman .., etc

    But, I agree that the four mentioned players from your post have lots of experience. All of them knows how to play every two or three card combination against any dealer’s up card at any count. And all knows how to bet. I would encourage you to invest $$ in your “dream” tem. For about 4-5 player team I would guess that $250,000 for start would be appropriate. Just ask a simple question: How much of your income comes from playing blackjack? – And then verify that they all have blackjack game the sole source of income. To be a BJ pro you have to pay all your bills and life expenses from actual winnings while playing the game full time. You have to wake up in the morning and go to work like a regular job.

    Is tough to make a living, day in and day out at the blackjack table playing red or green chips. If you cam manage black or purple action all the way up to the table limit, that in itself is a dream. The life become sweet.
  • TCash – Thanks for the compliment, but I’ve never really been interested in playing on a team…..even with such fine, upstanding true gentlemen like Nickels, Fred, and Bojack! I’ve had the opportunities and been asked, but the conditions and structure of team play aren’t really to my liking.

    In the late seventies through early nineties I did “partner up” (old timer term) once in a while with one or two other counters if we happened to be in LV playing at the same time; and play for a day, maybe two together……..but that was entirely different from today’s “team” play..

    Regards…..Grifter
  • tcash,i like your idea,no doubt in my mind those guys would KILL any casino!
  • Note that even though a player may be good on his own right, he may not make an ideal team member unless well-versed in the more advanced strategies of team play.
  • I understand what you're saying there Deviance, but I also think these guys have been playing their game long enough that it wouldn't take long for them to pick up the team play concept. Matter of fact according to various posts by Bojack he plays with a team right now. I think these guys could really do something. I know you already said no thanks to the idea Grifter, but I wish you might reconsider. I would love to see if the team play of highly skilled players could really take big bucks from the casino. What about the others what do you think?
  • team play works,and with this bunch of guys working as a team they would kick the casinos a--
    over and out!
    Prog
  • I kinda got the giggles outta this... I'm not a professional, nor do I ever intend to be one. I like the game, learned a lot of it by the seat of my pants. One thing about this I WILL say.... its truly amazing how hi-lo and A5 at the same table get along. Since very few people, and I mean very few, know and use A5... or have a good enough rule set to make it profitable... AND many people use hi-lo, or something like it, I get a bigger edge than you might think. All I need to do is find a hi-lo player.

    The chips as they say, tells the rest of the story.

    And wouldn't it be boring to see five people at one or two tables using the same strategy? We'd all know what they should do. But put five different strategies at the tables, and then we got some guessing by the audience/house.

    Why bother with real life, lets get a TV series on ESPN. lol
  • Separately, Alex makes an excellent point about "who is the best". And agree that progressive cover is worth it for image purposes. Perhaps one sees why a low spread, Missouri Cover, Progressive cover, and a "no 10 count" strategy got me as far as I did (which aint that far compared to the pros).

    Now more recently, in the past year or so, the games good rules slip away, and the house is VERY cautious about winning players. Thats why I expose a bit more here than usual. I strongly believe that the pihranna approach will win out over the shark-attack. Nibble'em to death with a LARGE group.
  • As you may or may not know I'm a huge advocate of team play. And Fred Renzey, Grifter, and Nickels n Bullets have quite a bit of knowledge and skill. That being said although I currently play with a team already-- I would welcome the oppertunity to play with any or all of them anytime. And on a different note a message to Alex. There is no rule that says to be a blackjack pro you have to pay all your life expenses with your winnings, and that you need to go to the casino everyday to do it. As a matter of fact I go to the casino on average about 8 to 10 times a month. Thats more than enough to sustain a very comforatable lifestyle. And as far as paying living expenses blackjack revenue has allowed me to make investments that do not at all have anything to do with blackjack, but in the same token supplement my income. I hate to encourage a response, but thats how it really is to be a professional.

Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!