Common Blackjack mistakes!!!
  • Some of the most common blackjack mistakes that I see are not hitting a hard 14,15, or 16 against a ten or an ace on the ace you lose up to 14 percent by not hitting it with a 16 the least percent of hitting! Or worse not fully hitting out a soft 16 against anycard I help people get past this one with some dealer advice if I can see there cards.
    The seconds mistake that I see is taking insurance when they have 20 this has an average house advantage of 14+ percent!!! While insurance has an average house advantage of 5.45% it can be an advantage player who has a count of plus nine you need to work out the index ratio. It starts at
    52-16=36/16=2.25 that is the ratio of tens to others. One non ten comes out of the deck and the formula is this 51-16=35\16=2.1875 Lets say ten no tens come out 42-16=26/16=1.625 profit from $100 insurance bet $37.5!!!
  • soem of those arent really mistakes, they are in the basic strategy
  • Third - Not taking advantage of doubling on certain soft hands.

    Forth - Splitting all pairs no matter what the dealers’ up card.

    Fifth - Drinking alcohol (back in the day, this is the one that cost me the most.)
  • I was just trying to tell you that none of them are in the basic stragedy and they are mistakes that cost the player making them heavily!!!
  • Costliest mistake I see all the time is when someone has been losing consistantly and they try to make it back by making one large bet.They lose 7 out of 9 betting $5,and suddenly jump their bet to $30-40. Its uncanny how often these bets result in a split/DD situation,which they can't cover.You just can't sit dowqn at a table,buy in for 4-5 units and expect to win on a steady basis,with nothing to back you up.
  • playing the game of blackjack, not understanding that if you don't play with some sort of advantage, you _are_ going to be ground down. Even if the house edge was reduced to .01%, that gives anyone playing that game a 100% risk of ruin if they don't have something to swing that to their favor, whether it be card counting, shuffle tracking, hole-carding, or something.

    Not understanding that the limit of that function as rounds approaches infinity is zero is a killer, and costs more players more money than all the BS mistakes in the world...
  • Taking even money on a blackjack all the time is a big mistake!!! As well as betting the side bets such as Royal Match!
  • Insurance on a 20, two tens is even worse than insurance on blackjack!!! It is common misconception that you should insure only good hands this is wrong! While it might hurt to lose on a 20 if the insurance is not a good bet it is the best play!!!
  • :?: okay,im learning to be a dealer for a big casino.........ive just!!! started.......anyone have any advice to me,the school is 5 weeks,im just nevouse as i can be,ive not played much just if someone has any good advice id be grateful,thanks soonerborn
  • Just curious as to why you'd want to be a dealer if you've never played much before other than online.
  • In fact most casinos don't want you to play if you are a dealer. They won't let you play at the casino you work at. The would prefer you to limit your play at other casinos to.
  • not splitting two 8's vs a dealer 7 you lose something like 64% when you do not do that play!!!
  • people increasing their bet after a blackjack! People feel good after they just hit a blackjack and usually increase their bets. This is mistake because after a blackjack with nothing else considered you are less likely to win the next hand and there for should decrease your bet to the minimum allowed!
  • learningtocount,
    Please explain your reason that one is less likely to win the hand immediately after a blackjack. I have not heard of this.
  • the idea is that an ace and 10 have been taken out of play. Your chance to draw a 21 on the next hand is reduced by some amount except in very odd cases (12 cards left, game dealt to bottom, 6 aces and 6 10's left. getting a 21 doesn't change much for the next round...

    but in general, the idea is wrong, because that is what card counting is about, keeping up with remaining deck composition and knowing whether you have an edge or not on the next round, regardless of snappers in this round. For example, in a SD game, A gets a 21, B gets a 6 card 20 (no aces). I'd be happy to bet big the next round, not the table min...
  • That's what I mean, SSR. I can understand my chances of getting a BJ are reduced. But the dealer could easily bust on that next hand, allowing me another win. Earlier this year I played a shoe where I got three naturals in a row. That doesn't happen very often, though.
  • Some years ago I read about a simulation that someone ran about your chances of winning a hand after winning the one previous. After running millions of hands they came up with a tremendously insignificant number that did show your chance was less and might cost you about a cent or two a YEAR. It was not based on composition of the remaining cards. Clearly it showed that just because you won, it really means nothing concerning the next hand. Just bet the count!

  • If you won on blackjack I like reducing your bet however if you won a double down hand especially where you had two 5's I like increasing your bet! The reason why you are more likely to win after a lose than a win is the dealer wins with an average of more cards because they have to hit to 17 when the player doesn't. The last hit card for the dealer on a winning hand is usually a low card!
  • learningtocount,
    That does not make any sense to me. Does anyone on this board have any comments? Stainless Steel Rat?
    Go back two posts and read ihate17's comments.
  • learningtocount has alot to learn still. he needs to learn that not hitting 15 vs. 10 or a 16 vs. 10 is SOMETIMES a CORRECT move.

    also, who cares what your hand is that you insure. I have insured some shitty hands and had to insure my hand because I had increased my bet on a positive count and the dealer had an Ace showing. I have won alot of insurance bets on crappy hands.

    one thing I have learned in my first few years in counting is that you need to do it as flawlessly as possible, otherwise from my observation in these few years experience you are wasting your time if you aren't on your game and play perfect. I learned that making an error here and there on occasion is very costly. Yeah, sometimes you can get away with a couple errors, but it doesn't always work out that way.

    learningtocount, just for advise I would not try and point out flaws in peoples play until you have learned how to count. just because someone deviates from basic strategy doesn't mean they are wrong.

    as for you saying people should not increase their bet after a dealer black jack is rediculous. so if the count is +13 after the dealer happend to catch the black jack hand you are telling me you wouldn't have your max bet out on the table? HAHAHAHA! Who has what hand is pretty irrelivent when you are counting. To say don't increase your bet in that scenario is bogus and is based on superstition and not numbers or fact.
  • my advice is to forget the "see a few small cards, bet bigger, see a few big cards (or a snapper) and bet smaller."

    Why not just simply learn to count. Then you know whether to bet big or small, and you have much better information, as you know about the _actual_ composition of the remaining (undealt) cards, rather than just about what happened in the last round. The whole concept of counting cards is to get away from that "whatever happened in the last hand can be used to guide me in the next hand." For example, you could have a RC of -20, and if 6 small cards come out, betting big would be a mistake.

    Learn to count, practice, get ready for reality as counters do _not_ win nearly every session regardless of what you hear. You can play with s thin advantage, but high variance on top of that means bankroll swings can be violently up or down. The hard part is remembering that even to play at a nickel shoe game, you need a couple of thousand bucks to avoid a quick and early exit form the game. A couple of spreads to $100 and losing can drain money quickly. And it is definitely going to happen.

    Try CV blackjack, and play it _honestly_ to get a feel. Playing heads-up in a SD game dealt to 10 cards left will make you feel invincible. But if, in reality, you are going to play 6 deck shoes dealt to 75 cards left, your results will change drastically... Once you get a feel for how the swings _will_ happen, you can be prepared for them. You can determine your RoR for a specific bankroll and game/betting ramp, rather than relying on guesswork.

    Your computer is your friend, if you use it properly.

    But things have (and are) changing. Played Tunica for most of this week. Looks like H17 is everywhere. Did not look at hi-limit rooms, but did not see any S17 games anywhere. Also didn't find any surrender games although I did not personally play every shoe game in every casino. So rules are eroding, penetration is down, I watched a counter get chased from one casino on a dead run, shuffle-tracking is far more difficult as most casinos I played at (shoe games particularly) had untrackable (at least for me) shuffles that were very good in fact at mixing the cards wildly. Half the games had no mid-deck entry (no wonging), the rest had a 100 max bet on mid-deck entry. So it is getting tougher and tougher, but if you persevere, the game can be beaten still. But it takes iron will, for starters. It isn't for the faint at heart...
  • is it just me or does it take forever to reply to threads?

    anyway, casinos-godamn greedy bastards
  • Even if the true count is at plus 10 and you have a high likely hood of busting you still gain more by hitting 16 than a 7! A plus ten count is highly unusual especially if you divid the number of decks by the count! The less the count is the more you gain by hitting a 16 vs a 7. In fact it is one of those things where always should apply. Please don't think of the one in a million hands where the count get higher than 10!
  • what is the reference to 16 vs 7? The point being discussed was that if a bunch of big cards come out in a single round, you should bet the min. That's wrong. That's all I was responding to.
  • 17 is a losing hand if you have a non bustable seventeen or soft 17 you hit you gain a minimum of 12% on average by doing this sometimes you even gain a lot more than that on average! It is huge mistake to stay on it even though you will make your hand worse most of the time off of the first hit. The times that you make your hand better will more than make up for it. The only way you can win on 17 is if the dealer bust. It is a little better than 16 because you can push with 17.
  • learningtocount said:
    Soft 17....It is huge mistake to stay on it even though you will make your hand worse most of the time off of the first hit.

    Actually, you will NOT "make your hand worse most of the time off the first hit."

    So, you hit (or double) a soft 17.
    4 cards will improve your hand - Ace, 2, 3, 4
    4 cards will still give you 17 - 10, J, Q, K (although it's now a hard 17)
    5 cards will make your hand worse - 5, 6, 7, 8, 9
    So, 8 of the 13 possible hands will either improve or keep your hand the same.

    I'm not trying to nit-pick but just trying to clarify.
    This was a difficult concept for me to grasp when learning BS.
    Once you look at it this way, it's easy to understand WHY you NEVER stand on soft 17 (at least using just BS) I can't answer for card-counting.
  • hi all-
    I think it's important for blackjack players to know what Fred Renzey said about the insurance bet in Blackjack Bluebook II.
    The two bets (your current hand and the insurance bet) have NOTHING TO DO WITH EACH OTHER! That seemingly tiny piece of information is worth TONS to any serious or even half way serious blackjack player!
    Best of luck to all-
  • Although I will personally look at my cards and hopefully by chance the other cards at the table! The only time that I will insure is when nobody at the table has a ten. There are a lot more people at the tables that will insure a good hand than a bad hand! This is usually a mistake!
  • Insurance is the most missed played bet in all of blackjack. I see people insure two tens twenty's this is horrible bet and carries an average edge for the house of 14%.
    I good time to take insurance is when you are on a single deck game and you see 2 or more hands without seeing a ten.

    Most people 99 out of a 100 think that you take insurance to protect a good hand and not necesarily to win the insurance bet. 1 out of a 100 people take insurance because there are a lack of tens on the table in the single deck game.
    Insurance on a shoe game is almost never a good bet,
  • learningtocount said:
    Insurance is the most missed played bet in all of blackjack. I see people insure two tens twenty's this is horrible bet and carries an average edge for the house of 14%.
    I good time to take insurance is when you are on a single deck game and you see 2 or more hands without seeing a ten.

    Most people 99 out of a 100 think that you take insurance to protect a good hand and not necesarily to win the insurance bet. 1 out of a 100 people take insurance because there are a lack of tens on the table in the single deck game.
    Insurance on a shoe game is almost never a good bet,

    With a highly positive count, much of the gain made by using indices for a cardcounter are made on the insurance bet. For a non counter, I agree it is a poor bet, but untold times, with true counts of over +3, I have insured hands from taking even money on blackjack to bad hands like 16 and it pays off. Learningtocount, if you are really learning to count, then do yourself a favor and learn the indices for insurance.

  • That is a very common mistake that I see another common mistake is staying on soft 17. Both of these moves cost the player a minimum of 12& of their bet on average.
  • Unless I'm dealing to you, the dealer advice has so mixed results that you should know how to play your hands before you walk into the casino to play blackjack.
    One mistake that I see all the time is standing on soft 18 against a ten. Last time I played blackjack I hit it out and got two 21'sgainst two 20's!!! your average gain by hitting out soft 18 vs a 20 is about 3%!!!!
  • On my blacjack stragedy I said that it was not a good thing to raise your bet after a blackjack!!! I said this with nothing else considered, I'm not considering the count. In this secenairo the average count would be -2 notice I said average so it could be higher or lower.
  • learningtocount said:
    .....and therefore should decrease your bet to the minimum allowed!

    This is what you said to do after a blackjack, and it is total nonsense.

  • Grifter said:
    This is what you said to do after a blackjack, and it is total nonsense.


    And how would that be much different from most of his "advice"?
  • Doubling down on soft 18 vs. a 5 gains you more than 10% yet most people that have soft 18 usually just stay. I would put soft 18 as one of the most missed played hands in blackjack!!! A lot of people will stay against 9-10 when you are supposed to hit. There are a lot more up cards that you can ouble aginst with 18 6,5,4,3 are the best ones all soft hands of 18 or less can double against 6,5,4
  • I agree that soft doubling is probably the most often misplayed situation. Also, people like to split even when it is not called for. Not the obvious ones like 5-5, 8-8, 0r 10-10, but some of the others that are more difficult to remember or they never bothered to learn.

    I can't talk too much though. Once recent mistake I made was playing the no DAS BS instead of the DAS one. I am not sure how much that cost me, but the KO book says that playing the wrong BS in that type of situation has a minimal impact. But I need every edge I can get and will do better next time. As I posted on another thread, I also used the S17 surrender rules rather than the H17. Still, I won consistently.
  • One very common mistake that I see is players will not read the rules that the casino has put in place. If they do read the rules they don't know what kind of effect that the rules will have on them winning and losing. Most people just assume single deck is the best game odd wize and with the exception of boomtown that is not true. The shoes and double deck games most places have the best rules and carry the lowest house advantage!!!
  • One very common mistake I see is using too many exclamation points!!!!!!
  • Chicken...this kid justs keeps on coming. I don't think he even reads the posts concerning his comments. Yea, the "!!!" is not good for his cover. Cardcounter good example..LOL
  • What we have here is a rookie dealer attempting to impose basic strategy universally with rigid statements. Also, to some extent, he is making an attempt to apply card removal concepts that may apply, in some cases, to single deck play.

    learningtocount does not qualify his remarks. He does not put his remarks in some understandable/distinguishable context.

    For example: In 1-2 or 6 decks we all know that an observant basic strategy player should hit 10,2 vs 4, but stand in 8 deck games. This is what I mean by context (skill level and situation).

    There is nothing we can do that will further his understanding until he is willing to grasp this concept.
  • To the man above me you are right you can hit 12 against a 4 if the count is negative enough and gain a lot by doing it!!!
  • Ray, if Learntocount can't help you out, 'Cardcounter' will.
  • Jim- I though better of my post and said why bother..just let it go. If you know what I mean....
  • learningtocount said:
    To the man above me you are right you can hit 12 against a 4 if the count is negative enough and gain a lot by doing it!!!

    You do not "gain a lot by doing it." If you are counting cards, and the count is negative, you will have a minimum bet out. That will have almost no effect on your win rate when you use this BS departure index. It doesn't happen very often, and the ev improvement is even smaller.
  • The difference in 10,2 vs 4 is -.211(s) and -.213(h) and you will receive a little over 6 of these per 1000 hands. Very little effect on EV.

    The interesting thing about this hand originated back in the good old days of single deck with good rules. The basic strategy player can improve his play a tiny amount by hitting 10,2 vs 4 because of the specific effect of the cards showing. This applies to 1,2 and 6 deck, but not 8 deck because of the reduce effect of card removal.

    Another similar situation exist for player (16) 4,5,7 vs 10. Because the basic strategy player can only play to the limit of his knowledge, he should stand with this hand, but hit 10,6 vs 10. Once again, the difference is a result of the cards that he can see.

    You can never judge a book by its cover......A new dealer may give a harsh and unjustified appraisal of a player that knows more than he...........

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