Multi-deck games are better than single deck games!!!
  • The rules have gotten so bad on single deck games that multi-deck games with better rules are now better for the average player. Single deck games offer double on 10-11 only no double after a split and no resplit of aces blackjack pays 3 to 2 thats the good game house edge .5%. The bad game 6 to 5 blackjack double on any two cards double after a split has a house edge of 1.5%!!! The shoe game at Crystal Bay Club has the best rules that you will find anywhere. The rules are 6 decks are used double down on any two cards including after a split except for aces, resplitting is allowed up to 4 times including aces, blackjack is paid 3 to 2! the house edge with optimal stragedy before card counting is only .5%!!!
  • "The rules have gotten so bad on single deck games that multi-deck games with better rules are now better for the average player. Single deck games offer double on 10-11 only no double after a split and no resplit of aces blackjack pays 3 to 2 thats the good game house edge .5%. The bad game 6 to 5 blackjack double on any two cards double after a split has a house edge of 1.5%!!! The shoe game at Crystal Bay Club has the best rules that you will find anywhere. The rules are 6 decks are used double down on any two cards including after a split except for aces, resplitting is allowed up to 4 times including aces, blackjack is paid 3 to 2! the house edge with optimal stragedy before card counting is only .5%!!!"

    I'll take the .5 single deck game over a .5 shoe every time.

    Why?

    - One card and you are even with the house
    - B/S is more accurate
    - Insurance bet is more dependable
    - Play variations are more accurate even with H/L, but more so with a good single deck count system.
    - Ace side count for betting is practical and simple with 1/4 deck counts.

    Wish we had a few in the midwest......................
  • learningtocount said:
    The rules have gotten so bad on single deck games that multi-deck games with better rules are now better for the average player. Single deck games offer double on 10-11 only no double after a split and no resplit of aces blackjack pays 3 to 2 thats the good game house edge .5%. The bad game 6 to 5 blackjack double on any two cards double after a split has a house edge of 1.5%!!! The shoe game at Crystal Bay Club has the best rules that you will find anywhere. The rules are 6 decks are used double down on any two cards including after a split except for aces, resplitting is allowed up to 4 times including aces, blackjack is paid 3 to 2! the house edge with optimal stragedy before card counting is only .5%!!!



    Learning: Again as you have often before, you have posted something you know about the Reno area and transpose it upon all of blackjack. In Vegas there are about a dozen casinos that offer 6 deck shoe games where the dealer stays on soft 17 and depending upon the other rules, the best ones with DAS, DA split up to 4 hands, RSA, and late surrender, have a house edge of .26%. You can find this game at only one casino for $5, but it is available at places like MGM and Monte Carlo for $10 and Mandalay Bay for $15 and many places for $25.
    Chrystal Bays game would in my opinion needs only 1 deck cut off to make it worth the time to play. It is marginal at best!!!!

    In Atlantic City, all the 6 and 8 deck shoes are stay 17 and though are not great games are better.
    In California, Ms, and other locations you can find much better games than yours.

    You need to get out more.

    ihate17
  • In Vegas there are about a dozen casinos that offer 6 deck shoe games where the dealer stays on soft 17 and depending upon the other rules, the best ones with DAS, DA split up to 4 hands, RSA, and late surrender, have a house edge of .26%. You can find this game at only one casino for $5, but it is available at places like MGM and Monte Carlo for $10 and Mandalay Bay for $15 and many places for $25.


    You need to get out more.

    ihate17[/QUOTE]


    Which Vegas casino has the $5 game you refer to?
    Thanks,Bill
  • In california's game you pay a commision on every hand weather or not you win, lose, or push!!! The commision is 50 cents a hand but if you are only allowed to play between $5 and $50 you pay a commision of 1-10%!!! Even though in california blackjack you get a push if you get 22 and the dealer gets 23 it is still worse because of the huge commision you are paying especially if you are a low limit gambler!
  • ihate17 said:
    Learning: Again as you have often before, you have posted something you know about the Reno area and transpose it upon all of blackjack. In Vegas there are about a dozen casinos that offer 6 deck shoe games where the dealer stays on soft 17 and depending upon the other rules, the best ones with DAS, DA split up to 4 hands, RSA, and late surrender, have a house edge of .26%. You can find this game at only one casino for $5, but it is available at places like MGM and Monte Carlo for $10 and Mandalay Bay for $15 and many places for $25.
    Chrystal Bays game would in my opinion needs only 1 deck cut off to make it worth the time to play. It is marginal at best!!!!

    In Atlantic City, all the 6 and 8 deck shoes are stay 17 and though are not great games are better.
    In California, Ms, and other locations you can find much better games than yours.

    You need to get out more.

    ihate17

    the joints that have the $10, $15 and $25 six deck tables.... are they wongable?

    best regards,
    mr fr0g
  • NYB said:
    In Vegas there are about a dozen casinos that offer 6 deck shoe games where the dealer stays on soft 17 and depending upon the other rules, the best ones with DAS, DA split up to 4 hands, RSA, and late surrender, have a house edge of .26%. You can find this game at only one casino for $5, but it is available at places like MGM and Monte Carlo for $10 and Mandalay Bay for $15 and many places for $25.


    You need to get out more.

    ihate17



    Which Vegas casino has the $5 game you refer to?
    Thanks,Bill[/QUOTE]

    Slots-A-Fun. It also has a double deck game where the dealer stays on soft 17 for $5.

    ihate17
  • sagefr0g said:
    the joints that have the $10, $15 and $25 six deck tables.... are they wongable?

    best regards,
    mr fr0g



    At places like MGM, Mandalay Bay, Wynn and a few others, if you are betting red chips or even light green, they do not even consider you as being there quite often, so wonging is not hard.

    One caution on these games: In many casinos, when the casino is busy they raise the minimums. At MGM for instance, I have seen them lower the S-17 shoe game to $5 early AM on a weekday, but then on a Friday night raise all the tables to at least $25. Also, big places never put their better games in the pits near the main entrance, look near the cage.

    ihate17
  • learningtocount said:
    In california's game you pay a commision on every hand weather or not you win, lose, or push!!! The commision is 50 cents a hand but if you are only allowed to play between $5 and $50 you pay a commision of 1-10%!!! Even though in california blackjack you get a push if you get 22 and the dealer gets 23 it is still worse because of the huge commision you are paying especially if you are a low limit gambler!


    I do not know for sure, but all the Indian Casinos in Southern California now how Nevada style blackjack and no commissions, and none of this 22 stuff. For the card clubs, I do not anyone who ever plays blackjack at those, they are really for poker only. The Indians do have some decent blackjack games, at least in the southern part of the state, especially Riverside County.

    ihate17
  • I hate to say this but if you’re looking for $5 games in Vegas or Reno you will find that they are unplayable. The crowd conditions are awful. You can not get a decent game unless you accept to play at full table. Another reason that the $5 tables are worthless is that even if you can play you will not make enough to pay for your expenses. At that level if you can pull 1.5% edge you will be making 1.5 average bets per hour and that probably translates in $15/hour. I would say that minimum $25 it require to make a decent income if you are a winning player. Even at that level, you have to put a lot of work to make a decent living, but it can be done. If you can handle black action the game becomes easy and the life is sweet.

    But for a recreational player who is taking the game as a hobby I would say that $5 is the game to get involved with. If somebody wants to play with this mathematical puzzle and take the game as a challenge than $5 is not a big deal. Actually it can be fun.
  • At the Southern California Indian casinos where they have real blackjack, is smoking allowed, or are they smoke-free the same as all the poker clubs there -- and the rest of the state for that matter?
  • Renzey said:
    At the Southern California Indian casinos where they have real blackjack, is smoking allowed, or are they smoke-free the same as all the poker clubs there -- and the rest of the state for that matter?



    Actually, all the ones I have been in allow smoking. I titled this visit Soboba because it is extremely smokey but has a non smoking area. They may be the only public (not really public) buildings in California where you can smoke unfortunately.

    ihate17
  • I hear you can reach him 24/7 at Barona since he's comp'd for life, but can't play BJ there. I'm sure he would know all the rules of every casino within a 500 mile radius. LOL

    Sweet Deal...When are they going to elect you to the same Hall of Fame Group? Your contributions to the game deserve it.

    Best, JP
  • ihate17 said:
    I titled this visit Soboba because it is extremely smokey but has a non smoking area.


    Their non-smoking area is just a slot-joint, right? I think all the BJ tables are in the smoking section.

    -Sonny-
  • Casino conditions create problems at low limit tables most everywhere. The best managed stores have crowd to table availablility down pat. The result is full tables and little opportunity to play these games effectively. This is more pronounced at isolated casinos because they better understand their customer base.

    Pit critters and other table game dealers can also deal BJ. This helps to eliminate schedule and other logistic problems.

    At times you can catch a break when $5-10 tables become $15-20 tables and low rollers tend to thin-out.

    An alternative that I have gone to is to play more DD at the higher limits, but it took me two months to get to the point where I had the necessary rhythm. DD is not all that easy to duplicate at home and you need to learn some negative indices.
  • JimPenn -- I really appreciate your flattery, but I'm just small potatoes compared to the likes of Wong, Snyder, etc., and honestly have no desire to gain their prominence. I do however, gain great satisfaction from helping people understand the murky innards of blackjack. Thanks again.
  • Fred-
    I seriously believe
    your book Blackjack Bluebook II is a blackjack literary masterpiece. As far as I'm concerned a large part of its' greatness lies in the fact that you didn't try to dazzle us with $100.00 words or theories. You did all you could to keep it simple and understandable. Kudos!
    rogue1
  • My favorite part is that he does not advertise the book as "the world's best counting system" but then once you open the book and start reading, you find "we have a far better system, but we are only going to sell a limited number of copies for $xxxx.xx to the first N people that inquire. this counting system is superior to anything else available and as a result, we are only going to sell a few copies to keep from flooding the casinos and burning the 21 games out. While the system in this book you are reading will beat the casinos, our new system has a far better win rate and is less detectable..."

    I won't mention any authors, but I'll bet Fred (and a few others) might know who I am referring to. Initial of last name is C. No doubt his "expert" system is very good, but the book got real old, real quick, reading all the cheesy plugs for the "better system" that was available...
  • Sonny said:
    Their non-smoking area is just a slot-joint, right? I think all the BJ tables are in the smoking section.

    -Sonny-


    Perhaps 6 months ago they put 4 or so tables in the non smoking area.
  • I'm not comparing shoe games to shoe games I'm comparing shoe games to single deck games!!! On Crystal bay club's shoe game I'm not saying that it is a great game but I do beleive it to ge a good and fair game. The average single deck game I believe is a cruel and unfair game!!! In the single deck game doubling is usually restricted to 10-11 and no 3 to 2 game allows doubling after a split. The rules of blackjack used to be 6 to 5 rules with a 3 to 2 payout. You could double down on any two cards and you could double after a split those where the old fashion rules of blackjack and perfect play carried a small advantage before card counting!!! The old rules on single deck do not exist any more!!! The old rules are before beat the dealer and are virtually gone from all the casinos today!

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