Question for Walter
  • I'm about 2/3 of the way through your book and while it seems to me that your progression does work (and works well - I'll be testing it out in LV in 3-4 weeks), my impression of the data is that the MOST important aspect of your system is the quit points. Like you say, quit leaning into the punch and get out of Dodge when necessary.

    Am I interpreting the results correctly? Would you agree with me that the quit points appear to be more important than the progression, or do you feel it's all intertwined? I base my opinion on the results quit points had on the flat bettor and counter, specifically.

    Thanks. I'm enjoying your book.
  • hi buffarino-
    i really hate getting up from a table when i'm feeling comfortable and/or I'm really enjoying the company of those at the table. you'd better beleive,after reading Walters' book i DO get up immediately and move to another table after losing 4 in a row!!!!!
    Just look at the results in his book!
    Good luck!
    prog
  • buffarino

    don't mean to argue, but...

    I found the opposite to be true of Walter's book. I liked his progression, but never could say I liked the quit points aspect of it, it just doesn't seem to make logical sense that quitting and moving tables will have any effect on your winnings or losings!

    I think it might be a better idea to set win and loss limits and use those as "quit points", instead of saying "4 losses and I am done"!
  • jmpoehler said:
    buffarino

    don't mean to argue, but...

    I found the opposite to be true of Walter's book. I liked his progression, but never could say I liked the quit points aspect of it, it just doesn't seem to make logical sense that quitting and moving tables will have any effect on your winnings or losings!

    I think it might be a better idea to set win and loss limits and use those as "quit points", instead of saying "4 losses and I am done"!


    Not an argument at all. No problem.

    From looking at the data, it seems the quit points are just as important, if not more important, than the progression itself. Look at the first set of data (the big one - 5,000 hands). Without quit points, everyone's a loser. With quit points, everyone's a winner (and a big winner in the case of the progression player and counter). My interpretation of that is that winning streaks and losses occur rather frequently. You want to capitalize on the win streaks and minimize the losing streaks. By adding a 4 loss quit point for a shoe (and if it's not busy, you don't have to leave the table), you take away any chance for the casino to rip off 5,7,9 wins in a row against you.
  • in his book Walter says he doesn't know himself WHY quit points works and that perhaps some day someone more clever than he will come along and figure out WHY they work.
    prog
  • How do you know that the next table you are going to sit at isn't going to have a long losing streak the second you sit down?
  • jmpoehler said:
    How do you know that the next table you are going to sit at isn't going to have a long losing streak the second you sit down?


    You don't. But if you sit down and lose 4 in a row, you get back up, wait for your beer to come (if you've even had a chance to order one) and go elsewhere. Just seems like a good way to cut the losing streaks short.
  • PROGRESSIONIST said:
    in his book Walter says he doesn't know himself WHY quit points works and that perhaps some day someone more clever than he will come along and figure out WHY they work.
    prog


    Good point, although I dont' know that I'm smart enough to know why they work, either. The only thing that makes sense to me is that streaks (both winning and losing) occur rather frequently. If you can take full advantage of the winning streaks and limit the losing streaks, you should be (theoretically) ahead of the game, assuming that winning and losing streaks are relatively equal in length and frequency (and actually, based on the house edge, losing streaks should be slightly more frequent).
  • hi buffarino-
    what you're saying makes sense to me. I use Walters' progression with quit points and it works real well for me!
    good luck to all.
    prog
  • Bump hoping Walter's around...
  • I'm here, I'm here! Been remodeling a kitchen and learning to play Texas Hold'em on line, so haven't taken the time to respond to some of your questions.
    Re Quit Points... Think of it this way -- If you could sit down at a blackjack table and never lose more than 4 hands in a row, but could win an unlimited number of hands in a row, would you do it? By leaving the table after 4 consecutive losses, you can accomplish this goal. Granted, you could go to another table and lose 4 in a row, then move again and lose 4 in a row, etc., but it really doesn't happen this way. Finding a "player friendly" table is an important part of this game, and Quit Points will help you do this. Even if your luck doesn't improve (and luck is a very important part of this game, even for card counters) the worst that can happen is that you saved some money while moving from table to table!
  • Thanks for the response, Walter.

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